to Erik Ribsskog
date May 31, 2007 4:37 PM
subject RE: Complaint
mailed-by citizensadvice.org.uk
Dear Mr Ribsskog,
I have contacted Liverpool Central CAB who have located the case notes of your visit to the bureau. The manager of Liverpool CAB will now investigate the points you have raised about the bureau and will send their findings to you within the next 20 working days.
Yours sincerely,
Saffron Follows
Complaints & Policy Officer
-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Ribsskog [mailto:eribsskog@gmail.com]
Sent: 23 May 2007 04:59
To: Follows, Saffron
Subject: Complaint
Hi,
I'm refering to my phone-call on Friday 18/5, and I'm sending a complaint against
the CAB in Dale St., Liverpool.
I enclose a file called 'explanation CAB', in which the problems are explained.
The last part of the explanation contains a section called 'Complaints against
the CAB, Dale St., Liverpool', in which the complaints are listed and indexed.
There is also a section called 'The complaint-process so far', in which this is
explained about in more detail.
Please just contact me if there is something else I should have remembered
regarding the complaint.
Yours Sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
The Citizens Advice service is a network of charities that helps people resolve their legal, money and other problems by providing information and advice, and by influencing policymakers.
• For information and advice www.adviceguide.org.uk
• For information about our campaigns, to volunteer or support us www.citizensadvice.org.uk
• Volunteer hotline 08451 264 264
NOTICE: this e-mail originates from Citizens Advice, an operating name of The National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux (Charity Registration Number 279057, VAT number 726 0202 76, Company limited by guarantee, Registered Number 1436945 England, Registered office Myddelton House, 115-123 Pentonville Road, London N1 9LZ). It contains proprietary information, some or all of which may be legally privileged. It is for the intended recipient only. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print or reply to this e-mail (other than for the reason stated above).
from Erik Ribsskog
to "Follows, Saffron"
date Jul 5, 2007 2:28 PM
subject Re: Complaint
mailed-by gmail.com
Hi,
Thank you very much for your answer!
I haven't heard anything from the CAB about this yet, so I was just wondering
what you think I should do if I don't hear from them one of the next days.
I hope you have the time to answer me about this.
Thank you very much again.
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
- Show quoted text -
from Erik Ribsskog
to "Follows, Saffron"
date Jul 22, 2007 6:48 AM
subject Fwd: Complaint
mailed-by gmail.com
Hi,
I can't see that I have recieved an answer to this e-mail yet, so I'm trying to forward it again.
Hope that this is alright!
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
- Show quoted text -
from Erik Ribsskog
to david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
date Aug 3, 2007 3:56 PM
subject Problems with the CAB
mailed-by gmail.com
Hi,
I'm a Norwegian living in Britain, who has had some problems with the contact with the CAB.
I've contacted your complaints-department, and the Complaints Officer regarding these problems.
The complaint was sent to my local CAB, but they didn't reply within due course.
Then I contacted the Complaints Officer twice, and asked how I should go forward when the
local CAB didn't send an answer to my complaint.
I've sent two e-mails to the Complaints Officer regarding this, one on 5/7 and one on 22/7, but
I haven't recieved any reply.
I was adviced by the Norwegian Embassy to contact the CAB regarding these problems.
And the problems in the complaint surrounds issues that also has to do with different Government
and other institutions, like the police and the law-society, and due to this and the nature of
the problems, I think that this issues should be dealt with responsably.
I tryed to find out about how the CAB was organized on the CAB website, I didn't manager to find
an organisation-chart, but from reading on the CAB website, it looks to me that you are the
line-manager of the Complaints Officer.
So, thats why I'm sending this enquiery to you, I'm very sorry if it has been sent to the wrong
person, but I think that the CAB should answer peoples e-mails, since the CAB are working
on issues regarding induvidual rights, then I think one propably has the right to get an answer
when one contacts the CAB. And also due to that I think
So sorry if I'm sending this e-mail to the wrong person.
I'm going to forward the e-mails with the correspondence with the Complaints Officer.
Hope that you have the time to help with this, and sorry again if I have sent this to wrong
address!
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
from Erik Ribsskog
to david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
date Aug 3, 2007 3:58 PM
subject Fwd: Complaint
mailed-by gmail.com
- Hide quoted text -
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Follows, Saffron
Date: May 31, 2007 4:37 PM
Subject: RE: Complaint
To: Erik Ribsskog
Dear Mr Ribsskog,
I have contacted Liverpool Central CAB who have located the case notes of your visit to the bureau. The manager of Liverpool CAB will now investigate the points you have raised about the bureau and will send their findings to you within the next 20 working days.
Yours sincerely,
Saffron Follows
Complaints & Policy Officer
-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Ribsskog [mailto: eribsskog@gmail.com]
Sent: 23 May 2007 04:59
To: Follows, Saffron
Subject: Complaint
Hi,
I'm refering to my phone-call on Friday 18/5, and I'm sending a complaint against
the CAB in Dale St., Liverpool.
I enclose a file called 'explanation CAB', in which the problems are explained.
The last part of the explanation contains a section called 'Complaints against
the CAB, Dale St., Liverpool', in which the complaints are listed and indexed.
There is also a section called 'The complaint-process so far', in which this is
explained about in more detail.
Please just contact me if there is something else I should have remembered
regarding the complaint.
Yours Sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
The Citizens Advice service is a network of charities that helps people resolve their legal, money and other problems by providing information and advice, and by influencing policymakers.
• For information and advice www.adviceguide.org.uk
• For information about our campaigns, to volunteer or support us www.citizensadvice.org.uk
• Volunteer hotline 08451 264 264
NOTICE: this e-mail originates from Citizens Advice, an operating name of The National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux (Charity Registration Number 279057, VAT number 726 0202 76, Company limited by guarantee, Registered Number 1436945 England, Registered office Myddelton House, 115-123 Pentonville Road, London N1 9LZ). It contains proprietary information, some or all of which may be legally privileged. It is for the intended recipient only. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print or reply to this e-mail (other than for the reason stated above).
from Erik Ribsskog
to david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
date Aug 3, 2007 3:59 PM
subject Fwd: Complaint
mailed-by gmail.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Erik Ribsskog
Date: Jul 5, 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: Complaint
- Hide quoted text -
To: "Follows, Saffron"
- Hide quoted text -
Hi,
Thank you very much for your answer!
I haven't heard anything from the CAB about this yet, so I was just wondering
what you think I should do if I don't hear from them one of the next days.
I hope you have the time to answer me about this.
Thank you very much again.
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
On 5/31/07, Follows, Saffron < Saffron.Follows@citizensadvice.org.uk> wrote:
Dear Mr Ribsskog,
I have contacted Liverpool Central CAB who have located the case notes of your visit to the bureau. The manager of Liverpool CAB will now investigate the points you have raised about the bureau and will send their findings to you within the next 20 working days.
Yours sincerely,
Saffron Follows
Complaints & Policy Officer
-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Ribsskog [mailto: eribsskog@gmail.com]
Sent: 23 May 2007 04:59
To: Follows, Saffron
Subject: Complaint
Hi,
I'm refering to my phone-call on Friday 18/5, and I'm sending a complaint against
the CAB in Dale St., Liverpool.
I enclose a file called 'explanation CAB', in which the problems are explained.
The last part of the explanation contains a section called 'Complaints against
the CAB, Dale St., Liverpool', in which the complaints are listed and indexed.
There is also a section called 'The complaint-process so far', in which this is
explained about in more detail.
Please just contact me if there is something else I should have remembered
regarding the complaint.
Yours Sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
The Citizens Advice service is a network of charities that helps people resolve their legal, money and other problems by providing information and advice, and by influencing policymakers.
• For information and advice www.adviceguide.org.uk
• For information about our campaigns, to volunteer or support us www.citizensadvice.org.uk
• Volunteer hotline 08451 264 264
NOTICE: this e-mail originates from Citizens Advice, an operating name of The National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux (Charity Registration Number 279057, VAT number 726 0202 76, Company limited by guarantee, Registered Number 1436945 England, Registered office Myddelton House, 115-123 Pentonville Road, London N1 9LZ). It contains proprietary information, some or all of which may be legally privileged. It is for the intended recipient only. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print or reply to this e-mail (other than for the reason stated above).
from Erik Ribsskog
to david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
date Aug 3, 2007 4:00 PM
subject Fwd: Complaint
mailed-by gmail.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Erik Ribsskog
- Hide quoted text -
Date: Jul 22, 2007 6:48 AM
Subject: Fwd: Complaint
To: "Follows, Saffron"
- Hide quoted text -
Hi,
I can't see that I have recieved an answer to this e-mail yet, so I'm trying to forward it again.
Hope that this is alright!
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Erik Ribsskog < eribsskog@gmail.com>
Date: Jul 5, 2007 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: Complaint
To: "Follows, Saffron" < Saffron.Follows@citizensadvice.org.uk>
Hi,
Thank you very much for your answer!
I haven't heard anything from the CAB about this yet, so I was just wondering
what you think I should do if I don't hear from them one of the next days.
I hope you have the time to answer me about this.
Thank you very much again.
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
On 5/31/07, Follows, Saffron < Saffron.Follows@citizensadvice.org.uk> wrote:
Dear Mr Ribsskog,
I have contacted Liverpool Central CAB who have located the case notes of your visit to the bureau. The manager of Liverpool CAB will now investigate the points you have raised about the bureau and will send their findings to you within the next 20 working days.
Yours sincerely,
Saffron Follows
Complaints & Policy Officer
-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Ribsskog [mailto: eribsskog@gmail.com]
Sent: 23 May 2007 04:59
To: Follows, Saffron
Subject: Complaint
Hi,
I'm refering to my phone-call on Friday 18/5, and I'm sending a complaint against
the CAB in Dale St., Liverpool.
I enclose a file called 'explanation CAB', in which the problems are explained.
The last part of the explanation contains a section called 'Complaints against
the CAB, Dale St., Liverpool', in which the complaints are listed and indexed.
There is also a section called 'The complaint-process so far', in which this is
explained about in more detail.
Please just contact me if there is something else I should have remembered
regarding the complaint.
Yours Sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
The Citizens Advice service is a network of charities that helps people resolve their legal, money and other problems by providing information and advice, and by influencing policymakers.
• For information and advice www.adviceguide.org.uk
• For information about our campaigns, to volunteer or support us www.citizensadvice.org.uk
• Volunteer hotline 08451 264 264
NOTICE: this e-mail originates from Citizens Advice, an operating name of The National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux (Charity Registration Number 279057, VAT number 726 0202 76, Company limited by guarantee, Registered Number 1436945 England, Registered office Myddelton House, 115-123 Pentonville Road, London N1 9LZ). It contains proprietary information, some or all of which may be legally privileged. It is for the intended recipient only. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print or reply to this e-mail (other than for the reason stated above).
from Erik Ribsskog
to david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
date Aug 16, 2007 10:58 PM
subject Fwd: Problems with the CAB
mailed-by gmail.com
Hi,
I can't see that I have recieved an answer to this e-mail yet.
I reackon that it's probably a letter on the way in the post, but I send this e-mail anyway,
just in case.
Hope that this is alright!
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
- Hide quoted text -
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Erik Ribsskog
Date: Aug 3, 2007 3:56 PM
Subject: Problems with the CAB
To: david.harker@citizensadvice.org.uk
- Hide quoted text -
Hi,
I'm a Norwegian living in Britain, who has had some problems with the contact with the CAB.
I've contacted your complaints-department, and the Complaints Officer regarding these problems.
The complaint was sent to my local CAB, but they didn't reply within due course.
Then I contacted the Complaints Officer twice, and asked how I should go forward when the
local CAB didn't send an answer to my complaint.
I've sent two e-mails to the Complaints Officer regarding this, one on 5/7 and one on 22/7, but
I haven't recieved any reply.
I was adviced by the Norwegian Embassy to contact the CAB regarding these problems.
And the problems in the complaint surrounds issues that also has to do with different Government
and other institutions, like the police and the law-society, and due to this and the nature of
the problems, I think that this issues should be dealt with responsably.
I tryed to find out about how the CAB was organized on the CAB website, I didn't manager to find
an organisation-chart, but from reading on the CAB website, it looks to me that you are the
line-manager of the Complaints Officer.
So, thats why I'm sending this enquiery to you, I'm very sorry if it has been sent to the wrong
person, but I think that the CAB should answer peoples e-mails, since the CAB are working
on issues regarding induvidual rights, then I think one propably has the right to get an answer
when one contacts the CAB. And also due to that I think
So sorry if I'm sending this e-mail to the wrong person.
I'm going to forward the e-mails with the correspondence with the Complaints Officer.
Hope that you have the time to help with this, and sorry again if I have sent this to wrong
address!
Yours sincerely,
Erik Ribsskog
"Harker, David"
to Erik Ribsskog
date Aug 22, 2007 8:59 PM
subject Out of Office AutoReply: Problems with the CAB
I am on leave until Thursday 30th August. I will reply as quickly as possible on my return.
David
The Citizens Advice service is a network of charities that helps people resolve their legal, money and other problems by providing information and advice, and by influencing policymakers.
• For information and advice www.adviceguide.org.uk
• For information about our campaigns, to volunteer or support us www.citizensadvice.org.uk
• Volunteer hotline 08451 264 264
NOTICE: this e-mail originates from Citizens Advice, an operating name of The National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux (Charity Registration Number 279057, VAT number 726 0202 76, Company limited by guarantee, Registered Number 1436945 England, Registered office Myddelton House, 115-123 Pentonville Road, London N1 9LZ). It contains proprietary information, some or all of which may be legally privileged. It is for the intended recipient only. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print or reply to this e-mail (other than for the reason stated above).
from Kristian Khan
to eribsskog@gmail.com
cc
Saffron.Follows@citizensadvice.org.uk,
Janet Ward
date Sep 6, 2007 6:42 PM
Dear Mr Ribsskog.
I am contacting you with regard to the complaint that you submitted to Saffron Follows, Citizens Advice complaints and policy officer, on 23rd May 2007. I have now been able to undertake an investigation into the issues that you raised and my finding are detailed below.
I understand that you attended the Bureau on 27th February 2007 and saw our Duty Solicitor Eleanor Pool on a free first interview basis about a harassment at work issue. Ms Pool completed a Bureau Legal Information Service sheet in which she advised you that you possibly may have a claim for harassment but there was insufficient time to obtain full details and you would benefit from speaking to someone who could advise on criminal aspect as well. Ms Pool took the case back to her firm, Morecrofts. You state that on 28th February you received a letter from Eleanor Pool informing you that they could take on the case at a cost of £140 per hour. I take the the view that any action taken by a solicitor after we have facilitated a free first 1/2 hour interview is not our concern - these concerns would need to be addressed to the solicitor directly and therefore I do not concede that the Bureau is responsible for this
On 5th April 2007 you had an appointment to see an Employment Duty Solicitor from EAD at 1.30pm . EAD rang shortly before your appointment to say that unfortunately no one from the firm was available to attend. As this phonecall was received very close to 1.30pm you arrived minutes later. (From my recollection the preceding client/s had failed to attend anyway).
As is common practice I apologized to you explaining that it was not our fault and provided you with the phone number of EAD so that you could contact them yourself to arrange an appointment with them to replace the cancelled on of 5th April 2007.
You state in your complaint that you rang EAD and spoke to Michael Reiner who took details of the case and advised you that you were outside of the 3-month time limit to commence employment tribunal proceedings and that only in very limited circumstances could this time limit be extended. You further state that you enquired about Legal Aid over the phone but Mr Reiner advised that he could not provide advice on this over the phone.
As far as I am concerned you did received a free initial interview from EAD, ableit in telephone form, so as such I do not feel that the Bureau was at fault.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Below I have taken each of the individual points that you made (in bold) and offered my response to each. I have copied and pasted the complainant's points from the actual email complaint made by you.
1. I think the CAB should have set up a new meeting between the duty
solicitor and myself, when the duty solicitor canceled the scheduled
meeting there on 05/04/07.
I did not set up a new meeting because the next employment duty solicitor slot was not until 24th April and that was fully booked. Therefore the next appt. would have been at some point in May and I was reluctant to leave things this long as I was aware (without knowing the details of the case) that time limits may have been evident. Furthermore, when Duty Sols. cancel they invariable see/speak to those clients at our request who were booked either on the same day or shortly after.
2. I think they should have informed me about the name of the duty
solicitor that canceled the meeting. They didnt do this even if I asked
them about this twice.
We did not know the name; indeed we do not habitually know the names - the firms send different people and it was the firm who rang to cancel saying that no one from the firm was available to attend.
3. I dont think the CAB should have adivised me to contact the duty
solicitors firm EAD on the phone on 5/4, since one needs to go through
the documents of the case in detail, to see if one are eligable for legal
aid. Which was what the scheduled meeting was supposed to be about.
Please see response to Question 1 - furthermore we do not take responsibility for advising clients on their legal aid entitlements at the Reception desk at the time of booking a Duty Solicitor appt - this is why people are referred to the solicitor if they require specialist advice .
4. I dont think the CAB, like they for the meeting on 5/4, should set
me up for a meeting with a Solicitors firms (EAD), that aren't based
in Liverpool. The Solicitor-firms that they set up to do task of Duty Solicitor
representaton, should be based in Liverpool, for practical reasons,
if someone wants to go to the Solicitors office to speak with
someone there etc.
EAD are based in Liverpool. Their address is: Prospect House, Columbus Quay, Riverside Drive, Liverpool, L3 4DB.
5. I dont think the CAB should have given me the wrong number
to the EAD solicitiors firm.
Upheld - I accidentally gave you the fax number (708-0606) and for this I apologize.
6. I think the CAB should have the lights on in the parts of their offices
where members of the public are recieved, and in their other public
areas, during their opening hours. This to insure that contacts between representatives from the CAB and
members of the public are kept in an atmosphare that one would expect
from a public place. (And not in an atmosphare that one would think
belonged more to a privat place/situation.) I think they should have the lights on during the opening hours, and that
they should not arrange meetings with members of the public to be held
with the lights off. (Like they did when I went there for the Duty Solicitors meeting, and ended
up first sitting waiting for several minutes in the dark, and then speaking with
the CAB representative for several minutes in the dark, on 5/4).
The lights were partially switched off as we were closed for lunch. I switched them on again when I began speaking to you and I admit that they perhaps should have been left on fully in order to create a professional atmosphere.
7. I think that the CAB should have informed before the meeting with the
Duty Solicitor from Morecrofts on 27/2, that the Morecrofts Solicitors firm
only accepted payment from private founds. And that Morecrofts didn't accept founding founded by the legal aid-
programme, like the Duty Solicitor from Morecrofts, Eleanor Pool, informed
me of on 22/3.
Please see response to Question 3.
8. I think that the CAB should have informed me before the meeting with
Duty Solicitor Eleanor Pool from Morecrofts there on 27/2, that the
meeting only was scheduled to last for thirty minutes. I wasnt made aware of this, untill Eleanor Pool first informed me of this when
the thirty minutes had passed.
As far as I am aware, clients are advised that the Duty Solicitor service is a "free first 1/2. I can confirm that both Reception staff and myself make clients aware of this at the time of booking the appointment.
9. I think the CAB should have explained to me about the legal aid system,
and how it works, before they set me up for the meeting with Duty Solicitor
Eleanor Pool from Morecrofts there on 27/2. Especially since this was an employment-case (like I told them that the
police had told me to tell them that it was).
Please see response to Question 3.
10. I also think that the solicitor I got to speak with on the phone (about when
one would need a criminal solicitor), when I was at the CAB on 20/3, should
have explained to me what her name was, and which solicitors firm she was
calling from. I was put in a room at the CAB, and told to wait untill the solicitor called me.
But when I answered, I picked up the phone and said 'yes hello this is Erik
Ribsskog speaking', but the solicitor didnt say eighter what her name was
or the name of her company was, she just asked what my questions were.
Also, when I had finished speaking with the solicitor on the phone, then
the CAB advisor had starting speaking with another member of the public
there, without informing me that our meeting was finished, and without
me being alowed to finish explaining why I had gone there.
I had gone there to ask about two things.
1. About when one needs a criminal advisor, and 2. how the legal aid system works.
But I only got to tell about the first point, before I was put in the room to
wait for the phone from the solicitor. Without me first being informed that
my meeting with the CAB advisor had finished.
If the solicitor failed to give her name then I am afraid that I do not see how the Bureau was to blame for that. We cannot be held responsible for what a solicitor does or does not do. You state that you attended CAB on 20th March 2007 and spoke to a criminal solicitor by phone, and then asked us about Legal Aid and was advised to check the CLS Eligibility calculator. If the Bureau was fully booked on that day then you may well have been advised to check this calculator as we like to offer some "signposting" advice that will enable the client to undertake some work/research on this case prior to their appointment at the Bureau. The CLS calculator advised that it could not assist you as you were self-employed and so you returned to the CAB and was given the appt. 5th April 2007.
11. So I think that the CAB advisor should have told me that the meeting
there on 20/3 was finished, before ending the meeting.
Since this would have given me the chance to explain that there were more
things that I wanted to bring up in the meeting.
It would seem that there was no availabilty for you to see an adviser on 20th March 2007 and this may explain why you were only given "signposting" advice i.e. be allowed to talk to a solicitor on the phone and then be given the CLS calculator website.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In conclusion I have investigated your concerns and I hope that you are satisfied with this response, however you should remain dissatisfied then you can contact the following:
THE CHAIR
LIVERPOOL CENTRAL CAB
1ST FLOOR
STATE HOUSE
22 DALE STREET
LIVERPOOL
L2 4TR
Yours Sincerley
KRISTIAN KHAN
GENERAL UNIT COORDINATOR.